Dear AFOLs...

[doodstormer]

Dear AFOLs/TFOLs,

It has come to my attention that you have several complaints with LEGO. In fact, I have made a list:
New Brown/greys
Fright Knights
"Jellybean" Knights
Single-sided buildings
Extreme sets
This actually has started to aggravate me with every complaint. LEGO was made as a toy, for kids. Kids like to actually play with LEGOs, instead of building complicated structures and letting them rot in an attic somewhere. People are always griping about how "stupid" sets like the KK2 joust are. What kind of fool would actually play with a toy? I thought it was pretty cool, with the launcher dealie. Then everyone complains about the new colors, when a kid builds, he doesn't care whether a grey is slightly blue compared to another.
Basically, not to be rude, but I'm saying:
IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU.
LEGO was made for kids, and kids enjoy it just fine. quit griping, try playing with some 8-year-olds. Heck, let them into your huge 200 fig army. You can rebuild them easily enough.
- Doodstormer

[Sir Dano]

I agree, I'm just happy LEGO still makes castle.
but you forgot lack of shields.

[Sir Kohran]

Well I agree with your point totally - I am also sick of the constant non-stop bashing of various things that aren't 'popular' among AFOLs. I'm getting tired of seeing the regular 'KK2 is crap' rhetoric. Not *everybody* hated those sets, believe it or not - I and others on BZPower bought those sets and liked them, and it gets annoying after three years to see the same constant statement over and over again. However I don't like your tone with 'GET OVER IT', which comes across as just a bit insulting.

- Matt

[doodstormer]

However I don't like your tone with 'GET OVER IT', which comes across as just a bit insulting.

- Matt

Sorry. K'edited.

[Formendacil]

Ummm....

AFOLs don't play?

Is this a rule or is it optional?

Seriously, I play as much as I build (and given that I don't do much of either, that may not be saying much outside of the Christmas holidays...), and one could say I've had sort of an uninterrupted flow of play since I was five, since I've never had a dark age, just "several-week long periods when I didn't have LEGO handy".

I remember playing with my 6081 King's Mountain Fortress back when I was young. The lack of a catapult never bothered me. The lack of colours like purple and light blue never bothered me.

This does not mean I don't understand play value. I really liked that hatch into the storage chamber of the castle (it was secret way to swim in for my Pirate). I thought the ghost was uber-cool. I salivated over the two sets of Euro armour I got with that castle for YEARS, until KK2 and Bricklink arrived. I was green with envy over my brother's sets of dragon plumes.

Do kids care? I don't know if they care on their own, but they'll care if the difference is pointed out to them. I have six younger siblings, and since virtually all of my new-bley, anti-KK2 griping has occurred online (or with Robin Hood, the next-eldest), I can say that I don't think I've influenced them TOO much about what the coolest types of Castle are. For some reason, none of them are big into Royal Knights or Lion Knights or Black Falcons. However, that does not mean they are KK2-loving freaks (well, one is... but that's limited to the Alendani). Instead, we've got a bunch of Yellow Castle, Black Knight, Dragon Master, Wolfpack loving kids. Now, they would not have had knowledge of those old themes without outside interference, but I think I can assure you that they get as much or more fun out of Bricklinked sets with no gimmicks that are twenty years old and lacking in colour as they do out of any KK2 or Castle 2007 set. And they were certainly onboard for approving the return to old cool pieces in Castle 2007.

What is my point?

Well, although it is possible that they are simply riding on the coattails of an older brother who simply didn't know any better about colour etc when he was younger and got inculcated to love bland grey, I am attempting to both agree and disagree.

I agree: LEGO is about kids and play value. Some of the stuff we dislike about the newer sets has to be tolerated because it delivers.

I disagree: LEGO has be colourful and gimicky to accomplish this. I agree to a certain extent (remember the dragon plumes), but I don't think it's necessary to go to certain lengths.

[doc069]

IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU.

Although, I would like to point out, this statement could be construed as being as narrow minded as the statements that you yourself are complaining about.

Keeping in mind my own feelings of a$$umptions - I would think that Lego's involvement with the ambassadors is, in part, to get a feeling for what the AFOL is interested in - they must care at least somewhat ($).

That being said, I agree - Lego is for kids. Full stop, don't pass go, etc, etc. I am working hard to build a Lego interest in my kids because I think it is the best "toy" hands down. However, I want their love to be life long, and as such, there has to something that is appealing to them as adults, which in turn will hopefully mean that it will be passed on to my grandchildren (way down the road).

For the record:
1) I like the new greys better than the old
2) I don't mind the new brown at all
3) I don't care what the new sets look like, as long as they have parts that I can use to build what I want to build
4) I have about 120+ of the KK2 knights - they work well for my kid's armies.
5) I have to agree that Lego doesn't need to go overboard with the brighter colours on their sets, but as long as they aren't the majority of the parts, then I just don't have to use them. If TLC feels that these new colours will bring more people into the Lego world - then all the better for me, as they will have to produce more sets to feed the demand.
6) My only complaint would be to have greater quantities of some these colours available (ie dark/bright pink, etc) so it would be easier to build my daughter's castle.

So is it about me - of course it is. I hold the purse strings to my family's Lego consumption. If I don't like it, then it won't be bought (by me). Is it only about me - no of course not. Lego needs to keep growing (if you are not growing, then you are dieing). Can Lego forget it's fan base - no, it cannot.

Is complaining about the changes going to matter - doubt it. But then again, I have embraced the new greys, I like both browns, and I have a good collection of the KK2 knights which were perfect for my kids.

I am, however, liking the new castle line better.

Regards,

Lee

[davee123]

It has come to my attention that you have several complaints with LEGO. In fact, I have made a list:
New Brown/greys
Fright Knights
"Jellybean" Knights
Single-sided buildings
Extreme sets

Heh, I think we can add quite a bit to that list!

This actually has started to aggravate me with every complaint. LEGO was made as a toy, for kids. ...
Basically, not to be rude, but I'm saying:
IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU.

While true, I don't think that ought to mean we can't or shouldn't complain. I understand perfectly well that the target audience responds better to something that I like less, but that doesn't change the fact that I like it less.

Biggest problem is that AFOL's don't like that explanation because it implies that Lego is changing its philosophy. Effectively, "when *I* was a kid, I would've liked it just the way it was, why change?" In other words, AFOLs are hesitant to believe that kids care so much that it's worth changing. So, part of it is complaining about the change in that respect. Perfect example: color change. Most AFOL's don't believe that kids cared one lick about the color, and that it only served to hurt things, since there was no upshot with the target market.

The other reason to complain is that, well, it IS about us! We're not Lego's target audience for most things, but we are a chunk of their business, and we'll gladly explain why we don't like sets. Like, I have an aversion towards the technic-frame-with-decoration building style that you see in Mars Mission and Exo-Force. So I don't buy much of those types of things any more, and I'll be happy to explain why, which is obviously a complaint. I'm fully aware when I do so (as are many other AFOLs) that we're not the target market, but that doesn't mean we can't explain why we don't find the sets appealing.

Then there's things that are just plain quality issues. Things that the company is consciously doing to save money at the cost of quality. These aren't things that are relevant to the market-- things like color variations and measurement tolerances. These weren't done because the target market (kids) wanted them-- they're done to save money, and AFOL's wish that these sacrifices in quality weren't necessary.

It's actually tough NOT to complain, because the contrasting awesomeness of older sets constantly inundates Lego builders, and will continue to do so until either the sets return to their former glory (not likely) or the sets become so far away from our own desires that we don't even bother to buy them at all (also not likely). I know every time I buy a new set, things like new gray, color variations, set design, lack of alternate models, lack of consistancy in themes-- even the set numbers themselves, blatently smack me in the face to remind me what it is that I *used* to like so much about Lego that's since changed. So, it's tough not to become that crotchety old man complaining about how much better toys were in our day.

DaveE, Crotchety Old Man

[Asterios]

my thoughts:

KKII nice sets only hated the "Crayola Knights"

what good can you say about Jack Stone?

What good can you say about Galidor?

What good can you say about the large KK's figs?

[Elephant Knight]

What good can you say about Galidor?

Absolutly nothing. In my opinion, Galidor was the most stupidest, most unLego thing that Lego made. Including Clickets. My younger siblings have a couple, and I thought they were stupid when I first layed eyes on them.

EKnight

[Asterios]

What good can you say about Galidor?

Absolutly nothing. In my opinion, Galidor was the most stupidest, most unLego thing that Lego made. Including Clickets. My younger siblings have a couple, and I thought they were stupid when I first layed eyes on them.

EKnight

when i was down south at the legoland in Disney they were giving away Galidor figs with any purchase if you bought a .10 LEGO piece you got a free Galidor Fig,heck they gave me a bunch of them,then i turned around and gave them to the Disney lost childrens area where kids go when lost to wait for their parents.

[J1A3L5]

Hi,

I'm part of the LEGO Ambassador Program. The very reason LEGO Ambassadors exists is so AFOL's can pass on their thoughts, complaints, compliments & ideas to the company. It's a company program: If our ideas didn't matter, they wouldn't have brought us into existence.

A large degree of what influences LEGO is the children, yes, but AFOL's are playing an increasing role in the LEGO Company and it's products.

-John Langrish; LEGO Ambassador.

[DARKspawn]

John stole my thunder. Yes LEGO do care what we think, why would they go to the trouble of creating an Ambassador program if this wasn't the case. Is their a group of LEGO child Ambassadors? No.

The CC server does not reside in communist Kazakhstan, meaning we DO have the right to state what we do & don't like.

This site is obviously aimed at AFOLs, although TFOLs are encouraged to participate, if you don't like what AFOLs have to say, then I can only surmise you are in the wrong place.

I am still confused by your logic though, internets forums only exist to give voice to those who have an opinion, coming to such a site & declaring you are sick of people having opinions seems a little weird...

[Maedhros]

Well I agree with your point totally - I am also sick of the constant non-stop bashing of various things that aren't 'popular' among AFOLs. I'm getting tired of seeing the regular 'KK2 is crap' rhetoric.

I would guess people "bash" KKII because they don't like it, and everyone would be entitled to their own opinion, no? I can see where you are coming from though, and sometimes there have indeed been too much thought-less bashing I think. On the other hand this site has had its opposites in times where you couldn't complain at all about KKII for example without getting told that you were a whiney spawn of a shifty-brick

Myself I can't say I hated KKII, but I would say it was pretty pathetic compared to a lot else that we have got. As I built the Castle of Morcia I just asked myself if it was a big joke.. sadly I don't think it was..

As adaptable as I am I did find use for the colourful armours and (wonderful!) new octagonal shields though, but I wouldn't have been sad if I had never gotten them either.

[boses]

Asterios---

I like the new KK2 super-figs. They came with many ratchet ball and socket bricks, in many colors. I couldn't have built many of my favorite moc's without the ratchet ball and socket bricks. The KK2 super-figs armors are useful too.

Case in point---

[doodstormer]

John stole my thunder. Yes LEGO do care what we think, why would they go to the trouble of creating an Ambassador program if this wasn't the case. Is their a group of LEGO child Ambassadors? No.

The CC server does not reside in communist Kazakhstan, meaning we DO have the right to state what we do & don't like.

This site is obviously aimed at AFOLs, although TFOLs are encouraged to participate, if you don't like what AFOLs have to say, then I can only surmise you are in the wrong place.

I am still confused by your logic though, internets forums only exist to give voice to those who have an opinion, coming to such a site & declaring you are sick of people having opinions seems a little weird...

Did you even read any of what I wrote?
I think ambassadors get the point just fine the first 3 times or so, why must you continue to complain about it? I am not sick of opinions, I'm sick of all the moaning and complaining about every single thing LEGO does. I came here to talk about castle sets and see other peoples MOCs. Instead all I found was people rambling on like old men in a bar about the "Golden Age" of castle. There was no "Golden Age". There was the age when LEGO was trying something new, which they're still doing with every theme.