Constructive Criticism of 10193

[Dan]

I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, but this set hardly covers any new ground and 95% of this set is a direct rip-off of MOCs and what the "fans" have been doing for years. The concept and scale are almost identical to my early custom kits and all of subsequent MOC's they have inspired. Hmmm... a LEGO cow? About 20 years late on that one! I'm sure most people here could build these buildings from their own bricks simply based on the pictures. In the end all you're really getting for your $100 is a few cows, a turkey, new printed tiles and some new minifig torsos. Those buildings are hardly original and you can find links to better right here on this web site. It's obvious to me that Lego is basically repackaging OUR ideas and selling them back to us and it blows my mind that everyone is buying it hook, line and sinker.

P.S. What's next? A Mark V tank from Indiana Jones III?

[Athos]

I don't know how to put stairs within the house itself though. If a person were to do that, he/she would have to remove one of the horse stalls. I did a count of the bricks and I figured that it would be impossible to use the "already-made" stairs and place it within the room without taking up all of the space. If you guys have a good idea on where to put the stairs I'd like to listen.

What about just a ladder? That'd take up less space.

By the way, are the decorated pieces stickers or printed?

Steve

[medieval_total_lego]

I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, but this set hardly covers any new ground and 95% of this set is a direct rip-off of MOCs and what the "fans" have been doing for years. The concept and scale are almost identical to my early custom kits and all of subsequent MOC's they have inspired. Hmmm... a LEGO cow? About 20 years late on that one! I'm sure most people here could build these buildings from their own bricks simply based on the pictures. In the end all you're really getting for your $100 is a few cows, a turkey, new printed tiles and some new minifig torsos. Those buildings are hardly original and you can find links to better right here on this web site. It's obvious to me that Lego is basically repackaging OUR ideas and selling them back to us and it blows my mind that everyone is buying it hook, line and sinker.

P.S. What's next? A Mark V tank from Indiana Jones III?

i partially agree with you dan, but there are many many acceccories and in my opinion almost 1400 pieces woth 100$

[Count Blacktron]

Have any of you noticed that the blacksmith's shop and stable lack stairs? I love how they included the water wheel but of course that takes up the place of the stairs.

I don't know how to put stairs within the house itself though. If a person were to do that, he/she would have to remove one of the horse stalls. I did a count of the bricks and I figured that it would be impossible to use the "already-made" stairs and place it within the room without taking up all of the space. If you guys have a good idea on where to put the stairs I'd like to listen.

Buy two copies of this set. Build the second set to be a rear view of the first, but design it reversed so that the stair ends up on the stable side. Plus or minus a few parts you should have a nice result.

[Handar]

I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, but this set hardly covers any new ground and 95% of this set is a direct rip-off of MOCs and what the "fans" have been doing for years. The concept and scale are almost identical to my early custom kits and all of subsequent MOC's they have inspired. Hmmm... a LEGO cow? About 20 years late on that one! I'm sure most people here could build these buildings from their own bricks simply based on the pictures. In the end all you're really getting for your $100 is a few cows, a turkey, new printed tiles and some new minifig torsos. Those buildings are hardly original and you can find links to better right here on this web site. It's obvious to me that Lego is basically repackaging OUR ideas and selling them back to us and it blows my mind that everyone is buying it hook, line and sinker.

P.S. What's next? A Mark V tank from Indiana Jones III?

Let me preface my remarks by acknowledging that I think you are in a unique position. As you say, the concept and scale are remarkably similar to work that you have done. In fact, one of the first things to run through my mind when I saw this set is how it reminded me of yours.

With that being said, I think some of your other remarks are a little unfair. To begin with, not everyone could build these sets with the bricks they already have. I, for one, could not. Because I am building up my collection, this set will be of great use for me, especially since it includes what appears to be a lot of really useful plain and decorative bricks. Having a couple of these sets is certainly going to help me to be able to build new things. I agree that this isn't true for everyone, especially for those people who only need a few of the decorative pieces. For those in that position, it seems far more logical just to buy those specific pieces on Bricklink. This, however, does not mean that everyone is only getting "a few cows, a turkey, new printed tiles and some new minifig torsos" for their money. I, and others in my position, will be getting much more.

As for the set itself, I agree that there are other MOCs out there that do similar things and do them much better. But there's a difference between a MOC and an officially produced set, namely that the set needs to be created so that it can be mass-marketed. An official set is almost always going to be less impressive than a MOC because LEGO designers have to hit a specific price point. MOC creators do not. I think it's unfair to compare LEGO designs to MOCs. It's like comparing apples to oranges. It's more fair to compare LEGO designs to other LEGO designs, and in that respect I think that this set is outstanding.

Finally, your claim that LEGO is repackaging ideas from the building community has some merit. Like I said, the buildings remind me of yours. Some of the techniques seem inspired by other builders. I don't think there can be any debate on that. However, how many of us have borrowed ideas from other builders? I don't find anything wrong with that.

I think what everyone is excited about is the fact that there are so many things in this set for which fans have been asking for years. The fact that LEGO has decided to make a set like this shows that they listen to what the fans want, and that is a very good thing.

For those who are more interested in building their own MOCs than official models and who already have expansive collections, then this set probably is underwhelming. It represents a few interesting pieces that will ultimately be purchased on Bricklink for a fraction of the cost of the set. Nevertheless, the release of this set is still a great thing because it creates those pieces in the first place. And for those who are interested in building and displaying the official models, then this set is head and shoulders above many of the other sets. It's effectively a Green Grocer for Castle fans. And for those who are building up collections, it's a boon to be able to get so much of what we need in one place.

I, for one, think this set deserves the extremely positive reaction which it has received, and I'll be quite happy to put my money where my mouth is come January.

[stuifzand]

As you say, the concept and scale are remarkably similar to work that you have done. In fact, one of the first things to run through my mind when I saw this set is how it reminded me of yours.

It reminds me of 95% of the tudor moc's I have seen
Because it's a good way to make tudor style buildings. I'm sorry but there's nothing unique about that.

[JPinoy]

Did I just die and gone to LEGO heaven?

With a set lik this, Fantasy Era theme by itself has equaled the Castle themes of the 80s and 90s. Come on LEGO, bring them on! Elves, Witches, Evil Humans, and whatever else!

[DanDanLegoman]

It's obvious to me that Lego is basically repackaging OUR ideas and selling them back to us

And I hope they keep doing it. Set design has been way better recently and I think it has a lot to do with getting ideas from fans.

[Brickzone]

Besides, as awesome as many MoCs are, I like when Lego manage to pull off something awesome within the restrictions of set design. It's not like one could sensibly afford to buy most MoC models. This set on the other hand is something I can buy easily *and* is a nice design.

For me the sets will be a very useful array of parts too - not just cows etc. It is pretty good value - I doubt you could achieve the same array of parts through bricklink etc.

I am somewhat biased in being a set collector - but I do not keep many sets intact for long - I like to have the option of building them into custom scenes, but apart from gems or sets I plan to customise later, I include them in my collection. For the most part, I find sets of all eras work well as parts-packs when you buy themes relevant to MoCs you will build.

Recent sets are in my opinion better than ever for parts, and some very stylish set designs too - some sets I will be including mostly as is in future MoC scenes.

[Dan]

The fact that this set has received such positive response is a good indication of how low expectations have been. Official castle innovations have been few and far between ever since they theme was introduced. The only reason that is being viewed as such a momentous move forward is because they have been moving backwards (or at best sideways) for so many of the previous years. I'm don't want to discourage them from making more positive steps, but they need to do a lot more before I'm convinced they are going in the right direction. It remains to be seen if this will be backed up with additional sets of the same scale: castles, churches, etc. And keep in mind that Lego is not changing their general direction because of one set. The fact that it is a 1xxxx series set indicates it is a specialty set for the AFOL community and LEGO Retail and will probably not make it into any mass distribution. For the moment I have an uneasy feeling of being pandered to, especially after so many years of this community being stone-walled. I am also uneasy about the implications behind innovations and themes developed outside their company channels being repackaging it as if it were their own.

That being off my chest, I do have some positive things to say about the model.

• Cows. Better late than never.
  Building are finally "the right size" and have four walls!
  Bringing back the turkey is cool and I like the duck and chickens too.
  Cool female(!) minifigs and peasant garb
  Curved roof slopes
  Wash Tubs
  Lots of nice window elements
  Price point is fantastic

Now lets hope this is followed up with more compatible castle innovations and is not just another "One Off" set like the Blacksmith Shop.

[Karalora]

Something I want to point out about official Castle sets vs. MOCs is that some of us are still beginners when it comes to designing MOCs, and having a set like this will make for good instruction and practice. I can stare goggled-eyed at gorgeous photos on Bricklink until the tiny plastic cows come home, but it won't help me figure out how to design and build castles and villages of my own. This will.

[Athos]

Something I want to point out about official Castle sets vs. MOCs is that some of us are still beginners when it comes to designing MOCs, and having a set like this will make for good instruction and practice.

Good point.

Though I do suggest staring at the brickshelf pictures and then trying to replicate it. You can usually figure it out, or at least a good equivalent.

Steve

[Munchy]

The fact that this set has received such positive response is a good indication of how low expectations have been. [...] For the moment I have an uneasy feeling of being pandered to, especially after so many years of this community being stone-walled. I am also uneasy about the implications behind innovations and themes developed outside their company channels being repackaging it as if it were their own.

Easy. Deep breath.

I agree with you but my reaction wasn't one of "They stole our ideas!", it was "WOOT! They finally listened to what we want!".

Glass half full and all.

I like the set. I'm not gushing over it. No tears were shed in my house. but I like it.

[Karalora]

I don't know. I'm usually too busy going "Oooooooooohhhhh!" to get any thinking done. Also, the most inspiring MOCs are naturally the most elaborate, and I think I ought to start from first principles.

[CVfan13]

Something I want to point out about official Castle sets vs. MOCs is that some of us are still beginners when it comes to designing MOCs, and having a set like this will make for good instruction and practice. I can stare goggled-eyed at gorgeous photos on Bricklink until the tiny plastic cows come home, but it won't help me figure out how to design and build castles and villages of my own. This will.

I agree with this. I wanted to say that yes, this is similar to MOCs, but does everyone have your godly skill, Dan? Answer: no. Simply put, if you don't like the set and can build something you are more happy with, then don't buy it. Also, keep in mind that Lego's primary market is KIDS (hence the fact that they are a TOY) and certainly most of them can't build anything like this. Therefore, this is positive for those who fit into that category.